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I want to buy DoggCatcher

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shizeon
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Last seen: 12 years 8 months ago
Joined: 03/14/2009 - 03:20
I want to buy DoggCatcher

I have been using the Beta since I got my ADP1 and really would like to purchase the retail version. Since I have a dev phone and live in the US, I can't find either the retail or the demo. I have been following some of the threads about Google's decision to ban adp1 users from copy protected paid apps. I am having a hard time understanding why a developer would turn on this copy protection feature. This seems to ban the people who would be the most willing to pay for an application. Anyone that has rooted their G1 can still buy and copy the application from what I understand of the system.

So, to buy any copy protected software, I assume I could do a nandroid backup, flash rc33, copy the app off, restore my backup, and install the copied software, right? I would probably have to do this for each update too :( And if someone felt so inclined could also return the software in the process to get it for free anyhow.. So, if my understanding is correct, this does little to help piracy, but just puts more steps between getting software to one of the audiences (adp1 users) more likely to pay for a quality app. If someone wants to really pirate the app, this doesn't seem to do anything to prevent it.

Would be curious to know the amount of rooted G1 owners vs ADP1 users. My guess is there are probably more rooted G1's out there. I would speculate (could be totally wrong) that if a pirated version did leak out somewhere, that the source would be a rooted G1. Please consider removing the copy protection option and opening this wonderful application to all :) Just my two cents, would love to hear others opinions on the topic.

Thanks!
- Sean

eric
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Last seen: 1 year 8 months ago
Joined: 11/06/2008 - 22:02
I'm glad you asked

With what we know now, there is little to no benefit in using copy protection...and there are some drawbacks.

I prefaced that with 'what we know now' because at the time the paid apps were first released on the market, all we knew about copy protection was that it required a bit more memory on the phone to run a copy protected app. I thought...what could it hurt, I would just turn it off later if it turned out to be a bad idea.

One thing I should have known and I clearly made a mistake thinking that the copy protection would be effective. It's usually not as history has proven.

There are two very important things that we learned *later*.
1 - Once you turn on copy protection, you can't turn it off with having users un-install and re-install their apps. In the process you would lose your feed database. This was learned the hard way for a lot of devs and users.
2 - Some phones (dev) would not be able to access copy protected apps.

It's not perfect but we are where we are, so where do we go from here.

I can't turn off copy protection now or any future updates to existing customers would break their app. There is a bug (I believe with an engineer assigned) to address this. I will turn off copy protection when this is resolved. I'm hoping it will be fixed in the next OTA update.

There are other options I looked at like creating another app in the market that is not copy protected. This is a bit cumbersome due to the way the market constrains unique id's for apps. There are lots of weird manual things you have to do to get this to work.

It may also be possible to use one of the other app markets, I'll probably take a look at them to see if that makes sense.

I mainly want you to know that I am not leaving it as copy protected because I think it will protect the app from copying :-) I'm kind of stuck right now.

As I'm sure you can believe, I want you to have access to the app, as much as you want to have it. I'll keep pursuing these other avenues and let you know what I turn up.

Eric.

shizeon
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Last seen: 12 years 8 months ago
Joined: 03/14/2009 - 03:20
Thanks

Thanks for the well articulated reply. I understand the situation now. Too bad :( It makes sense though, heres to hoping Google changes this for the better or at least allow downgrading easier. I subscribed to your RSS, so will keep an eye out to see if things change.

Many thanks,
Sean

mag
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Last seen: 6 years 8 months ago
Joined: 05/23/2009 - 17:17
In the same boat

Hey, Eric.

First of all, thank you for writing DoggCatcher.

I would also like to echo Sean's concern. I love DoggCatcher - it is easily the most used 3rd party app on my phone - and am perfectly willing to pay for it. Unfortunately, having a dev phone, I cannot purchase copy-protected apps.

I'd guess that switching app protection modes is not a very frequently used feature, and as such improving it is probably not very high on the Android team's priority list, so I wouldn't hold my breath for it to be fixed.

As such any interim solution would be greatly appreciated :)

Thanks,
Michael.

PS. What about adding automatic backup of feed configuration to the sd card? *ducks*

eric
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Last seen: 1 year 8 months ago
Joined: 11/06/2008 - 22:02
SlideME

I would be happy to publish it on SlideME. I haven't used it before but I'll give it a shot if you think it's worth it.

On the topic of switching from protected to non-protected...I don't think they are going to add support for that. They changed the description next to the radio button for picking whether it's copy protected or not to something like...once you copy-protect it, you can't change it.

When you say automatic backup, you mean just extending the existing backup function such that the user doesn't have to do anything, like maybe just keep the most recent x number of backups automatically right?

mag
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Last seen: 6 years 8 months ago
Joined: 05/23/2009 - 17:17
For what it's worth

I must admit I am a bit skeptical of SlideME and other alternative markets. Fundamentally, now that the native android marketplace supports payed apps, I don't really see the value add of these other markets. As such I can easily see a situation where they will close down some time in the future, and you will be out of luck for any apps you may have purchased from them.

The backup idea was actually not so much a feature request, as suggestion of how to handle upgrading existing users to an incompatible signature. If DoggCatcher automatically backed up the set of configured feeds to the SD card, and imported it when first started if no feeds have been configured in the internal store, existing users would not lose all their feeds/state when reinstalling.

Alternatively, have you considered adding another version of DoggCatcher without copy protection to the native Market under a different name?

Anyway, those are my 2 cents.

Thanks again,
Michael.

eric
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Last seen: 1 year 8 months ago
Joined: 11/06/2008 - 22:02
Slideme

I agree to some degree. I think the key is having mass. If slideme got to a point where a large number of devs and users were using it, it could provide a good alternative...it's always good to have have a little competition. But now, not many people are using it so I understand the concern with long term viability. I would like to see them grow.

Backup - that's exactly how I moved the db from the beta to the retail version. It had a manual step to export, but other than that it's just what you describe. I'm not sure that this would work in the scenario of moving from one app to another in the market because the user would have to buy the "new" app again. As far as the market is concerned, the old and new apps have no relationship.

Another version - I did look into this (along with many other people in the same boat) and due to the way the market uniquely identifies apps and auto-generates some code that needs to go into each app, there isn't a way to have two versions of the same app without doing some crazy build scripts to do string replacements in the code so you could have two different versions. I did get this working but it was so error prone, I didn't want to take the risk of publishing apps that were brittle.

I have looked into adding a shopping cart to this web site and distributing the app here. It would take some time to set up but for the long haul, it's probably the way to go. Then I could handle other models such as subscription based.

Thanks for the feedback, I'll let you know if I make any progress with the cart thing.

richard.waid
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Last seen: 4 years 9 months ago
Joined: 07/09/2009 - 22:59
Perhaps an unprotected app available through the forums?

Hi Eric:

Just a thought -- for those with rooted phones, how about an unprotected version just available through the forum, like the updates you provide for those of us without a 'paid' app store (like New Zealand). I'd like to root my phone but would *really* hate to lose access to this brilliant piece of software (especially since I paid for it :)).

Seems like a really simple solution, and you'd be able to warn people about losing their config in the post text.

Thanks for a great app BTW, best money I've spent since buying my Magic, and I DoggCatcher at least a couple of hours a day.

eric
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Last seen: 1 year 8 months ago
Joined: 11/06/2008 - 22:02
It's available now

The apk that's in the forum for registered users is not copy protected. Devs don't actually produce copy protected versions of their apps.

The way I understand the copy protection to work is that it uses forward-locking upon installation. So when you install the app in a certain 'mode', the app becomes locked. I guess the term forward is related to the fact that you cannot reverse the lock...and why I can't change the market version to un-copy-protected.

ChicagoPete
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Last seen: 4 years 6 months ago
Joined: 12/11/2008 - 16:37
Rooted

I just rooted my phone last night, and was able to redownload DC from the market. I used that 1-click method and installed the newest Cyan experimental build, 3.9.11 I think.

mcamou
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Last seen: 6 years 1 month ago
Joined: 01/20/2009 - 17:12
Cyanogen's 4.0.1 is the

Cyanogen's 4.0.1 is the latest, he Tweeted that 4.0.2 would probably be released today.

ChicagoPete
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Last seen: 4 years 6 months ago
Joined: 12/11/2008 - 16:37
True

From what I've read, the version 4.x series is the "stable" build, while the 3.9x series is the "experimental" line. I wanted to try out the extra donut stuff.

Anyway, I was thinking about this some more, and it could be the reason that I was able to download DC after rooting is because I had already purchased it while not rooted.

Karolis
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Last seen: 9 years 10 months ago
Joined: 04/08/2009 - 10:32
I bought DC long after

I bought DC long after rooting my phone. Don't realy see how this is related.

And if it is, just get the market enabler and it should let you do it.

tkrag
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Last seen: 11 years 2 months ago
Joined: 06/11/2009 - 06:15
Similar situation in Denmark

I just bought the htc magic in denmark, and one of the things i checked before buying was that there was a decent podcatcher available, and finding doggcatcher i spent my money happily, only to find out that there are no paid apps in the market in denmark, and hence apparently no way to get doggcatcher.

I'd gladly pay USD 20 to get it now rather than wait until google decies we're worthy of paying for apps here.

claus64
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Last seen: 12 years 6 months ago
Joined: 06/12/2009 - 07:11
I agree tkrag

I am also in Denmark and I feel buttfu**ed. Bought a new phone and now I am standing here with a 6 month subscription and nothing to use the phone for... Tkrag. Did you find some other usable program for Podcasts? I am looking for a program which can get the Podcasts from Danish Radio (DR)

Claus

eric
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Last seen: 1 year 8 months ago
Joined: 11/06/2008 - 22:02
Beta version

There's a beta version of DoggCatcher that is available in the market for free for users that don't have access to priced apps. However I hadn't enabled it for Denmark until a few moments ago. Search now and you should be able to find it.

The priced version has been updated quite a bit since the beta version but the beta is pretty reliable, it's just missing some features in the priced app. Hopefully it will get you your podcasts in the mean time.

KimH
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Last seen: 2 years 3 weeks ago
Joined: 06/10/2009 - 16:46
Still not in the market in Denmark

Hi Eric,

I still do not see the beta in the market in Denmark :-(

/Kim

eric
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Last seen: 1 year 8 months ago
Joined: 11/06/2008 - 22:02
Same in Canada

I just confirmed that the beta is published (at least in the dev console where we publish) to Denmark.

I have had a similar report from another user in Canada (where it's also published).

I know that there have been cases where apps are filtered based on priced and/or copy protection with some carriers, but I'm not sure of the details around why that's the case. That may be what's happening here. Sometime it can be difficult to get information on these kinds of things.

eric
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Last seen: 1 year 8 months ago
Joined: 11/06/2008 - 22:02
No priced for Canada

The issue in Canada turned out to be the lack of priced apps, but 'coming soon'.

KimH
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Last seen: 2 years 3 weeks ago
Joined: 06/10/2009 - 16:46
Not even in the priced apps in Denmark

Hi,
I have now got access to priced apps on my Danish Android phone. But I still don't see either of the DoggCatcher version in the market :-(

Is the market the only place to get this app.?

/Kim

eric
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Last seen: 1 year 8 months ago
Joined: 11/06/2008 - 22:02
Interesting

I just checked on the market site where we publish apps and Denmark is not able to be selected for pay apps. That's pretty interesting that you are able to see other pay apps.

I just started the process of creating a paypal account so that I can make the app available outside of the market. It's gonna take a couple more days to get all the pieces in place. I'll let you know as soon as it's ready.

Thanks for being so patient as I get this worked out.

KimH
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Last seen: 2 years 3 weeks ago
Joined: 06/10/2009 - 16:46
Hi Eric The reason that I see

Hi Eric

The reason that I see paid apps in Denamrk is because I used the app called "Market enabler' which fools the market to believe that I am using in another provider in another country (e.g T-mobil in the US).

Priced apps is still not officially available in Denmark :-( However I am looking forward to your PayPall solution :-)

Regards
Kim

eric
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Last seen: 1 year 8 months ago
Joined: 11/06/2008 - 22:02
Paypal

I've added a paypal link at the top right of the site (I'm sure you've seen it already). Let me know if you run into any problems.

blackhuey
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Last seen: 12 years 4 weeks ago
Joined: 11/10/2009 - 04:07
paid apps

Hi,
I bought a Hero in Australia yesterday, as it turns out it's an eastern Euro model (it's not officially out in Australia yet) and only supports 4 or 5 eastern Euro locales, none of which are currently enabled for paid apps.

So, no paid apps for me, even though I'm physically in Australia using a Hero bought here and Australia is paid-app enabled.

Is there another way to get DoggCatcher paid for and installed other than using the official market?

eric
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Last seen: 1 year 8 months ago
Joined: 11/06/2008 - 22:02
You can purchase through paypal

There's link DoggCatcher menu above - How to buy.

Here's a direct link